VDAC Foren

Hallo,
es gibt international eine laufende Diskussion zu verschiedenen Themen, bei welchen wir auch eine VDAC Position entwickeln sollten. In den nächsten Tagen und Wochen lade ich Euch hier zum Austausch ein, damit wir zur Jahreshauptversammlung, oder nachfolgend zu einer Abstimmung kommen können.

Erstes Thema: Ein Gate statt der Luv- und Ablauf-Boje. Wir kennen dies aus dem Sailing-GP. Auch in Campione gab es bereits zwei Regatten mit diesem Format, was recht gut funktioniert hat, wenn das Gate groß genug ist (ca. 10 Bootslängen). Wie auch ein Lee-Gate kann das Windward-Gate den Verkehr entzerren. Aber grundsätzlich fällt der „Verzieher“ weg... Wir wollen das Windward-Gate auch bei unserer NL-GER-Open dieses Jahr in Malcesine testen, - wie von der IACA gewünscht.

Auch die Australier tragen ihre Regatten seit ein paar Jahren in diesem Format aus und sind zu „98%“ überzeugt. Auch auf Facebook gab es zum Thema in der Gruppe, Classe A eine Diskussion und Abstimmung, die recht interessant ist, wer mag und es noch nicht gelesen hat, schaut bitte gerne mal rein.

Darren Bandock schrieb folgendes:

Proposal to Implementing a Windward Gate
A number of A-Class national fleets have been trialing windward gates as seen in SailGP, Americas Cup and Moth racing with a lot of success.
Mark 1 and 2 which normally provides the offset top marks is replaced with a windward gate and operates very similar to our current leeward gate.

Advantages
Tactical options, it is no longer a follow the leader race around the top mark and out to the left hand side of the course. Both sides of the course can be utilized equally.
It will discourage boats coming to the top mark on port and tacking in the 3 boat length zone.
Boats are no longer forced to overlay the starboard lay line in fear of having to double tack at the windward mark if they underlay.
The fleet is split and the race course is less congested

Disadvantage
Potentially 1 more Port/Starboard encounter in a confined area but no different to the port boat coming into the current top mark to round to port.
The proposal is to try the windward gate at the 2025 World Championships in Milford, New Zealand as it is believed we will have a smaller fleet than events in Europe and it will give a great chance to evaluate the windward gate with a high caliber fleet.
A normal championship course would consist like below:
Start - 1P/1S - 4P/4S - 1P/1S - 4P/4S - 1P/1S - Finish.

Hallo allerseits,

Windward-Gate hat Vor- und Nachteile, aber aus meiner Sicht mehr Vorteile, vor allem taktisch. Die klassische Luvtonnen-Konfiguaration mit Tonne 1 und 2 hat auch ihre Tücken. In Punta Ala bei der WM mit 86 Classic-Booten an der ersten Luvtonne war es kein Spaß...

Zumindest mehrere Tests wären daher eine gute Sache. Die partiell etwas differierenden Regelfragen an Gates könnten im Vorfeld durch Guidelines geklärt werden.

Was ich gar nicht gut fände: Bei Tonnenkonfigurationen zwischen Foilern und Classics zu unterscheiden. Eine Klasse, zwei Divisionen, mit denselben Regeln soweit irgend möglich.

PS: Für die Wendefaulen unter uns: Bei Luvgates muss man an der Kreuz nur noch einmal wenden, wenn man das denn möchte

Hier eine schöne Skizze zur Regelsituation am Windward Gate. Jeweiliges grünes Boot hat Wegerecht. Vieles ist ähnlich wie an Luvtonne/ Ablauftonne. Dazu die Erläuterungen:

Path A: When a boat chooses this path, it never looses right of way. All other boats have to keep clear. There is 16.1 limitation in position 3 if the other boat tacked inside the zone (but not if the other didn't tack) and a 16.1 limitation in position 4.
Only if you gybe after rounding the mark, you become keep clear boat (RRS 11) to boats approaching on the port lay line.

Path B: You start being the keep clear boat and only very shortly become right of way boat, all the way round the starboard gate mark. Briefly in position 3 the starboard boat is subject to rule 13, and then you are right of way boat. If you have to react in that period, for instance have to luff to avoid him, starboard is breaking rule 13. The only other change you have, is to get an inside overlap while starboard is subject to rule 13. Then you are entitled to room and are r.o.w. leeward boat.

Path C: Also not bad from a rules point of view, but with a nasty twist during the rounding. On starboard you are right of way boat and if you time it right, the port/windward boat has to keep clear. But, if you go trough head-to-wind, before port has to react, your are not keeping clear under rule 13. If port manages to get an inside overlap before you are back on close hauled course, you have to give him room and keep clear as windward boat. If you manage to keep port to windward and keep clear during the tack, you again become right of way leeward boat. Your only limitation is rule 16.1, giving port/windward room to keep clear while you bear away. You best bet is to slow down in position 2, or luff head-to-wind and wait for port to tack before you do. After the rounding, you have to keep clear of the starboard boats approaching on the lay line, whether you gybe or not.

Path D: Approaching on the lay line, you have right of way on boats who have gybed after rounding, but otherwise you are always keep clear boat. Because you completed your tack inside the two boat lengths zone you have to watch out that you don't force starboard boats above close hauled, to avoid you. You also have to keep clear of any starboard boat which manages to get an inside overlap.

In order of preference your best course is path A, then path C, then path B and finally path D.

Und hier das ganze nochmal für den Fall, dass Boote auf demselben Bug (Wind von Steuerbord) unterwegs sind):

Boats approaching on the same tack: both on starboard and not overlapped
Entering the 2 BL zone there's no difference between left or right hand gate mark; in both cases rules 12 and 18.2(c) dictate that the clear astern boat shall keep clear. Rounding the left mark the clear ahead boat has no limitations. Rule 16.1 is off, she can round the mark anyway she wants.
At the other side, at the right hand mark, the clear ahead boat faces a dilemma. As soon as she passes head to wind, rule 18.2(c) switches off and stays off. If the clear astern boat is close enough, the boat passing head to wind has to keep clear under rule 13 (tacking) and on top of that, if the boat from clear astern manages to create an inside overlap, she has to keep clear after tacking as well.
There is a solution for this problem, one that most sailors find hard to execute. Slow down when your next to the mark luffing head to wind, but not passed that. As soon as the boat from clear astern gets an overlap on the OUTSIDE and passes head to wind you can go. Because then both boats are tacking and the one on the right has r.o.w. Once tacked the boat on the outside has to keep clear under 11 and give room under 18.2(a).
This course of action - or better lack of action - also gives you some protection, if the boat from clear astern does create an inside overlap. The second part of rule 18.2(e) states, 'If the outside boat is unable to give room when the overlap begins, rules 18.2 (a) and rule 18.2(b) do not apply'. Also when you are stationary and can hardly change course, the other boat has to give you time to move under rule 15. But remember all of this depends on you NOT passing head to wind!

From good to bad, your best course is:
course D; staying r.o.w. boat all the way round, even toward approaching port takers, once you've rounded

course C: but you have to stay alert and either be fast enough or play it clever

course A: you have a chance, if you are close enough to the boat in front and can get an inside overlap at the right moment and not too soon.

course B: you will have to keep clear all the way round, and better not gybe after, because then port close hauled tackers go first as well.

Hallo zusammen,

aus meiner Sicht kommt es hier auf praktische Versuche und daraus gewonnene Erfahrungen an. Wenn das System anderswo auf der Welt bereits praktiziert und auf Grund positiver Erfahrungen regelmäßig wiederholt wird, sollten wir uns davor nicht verstecken.

Viele Grüße
Lars

Moin zusammen, ich glaube, ob das Luv-Gate für Entzerrung sorgt oder sogar für noch mehr Chaos, hängt entscheidend davon ab, wie breit das Gate ist. Ausprobieren, bei ausreichend großem Gate kann ich mir das schon gut vorstellen.

Leider fällt damit das einzige Stückchen nicht-up&down weg. Kann man sich natürlich drum streiten, ob das beim A-Cat, der ja ziemlich auf up&down optimiert ist, gut oder schlecht ist.